After the Webinar: Pain Comes from Resistance to Change. Q&A with Dr. Jackalyn Rainosek

Webinar presenter Dr. Jackalyn Rainosek answered a number of your questions after her presentation, Pain Comes from Resistance to Change: The Ways to Embrace Change. Here are just a few of her responses.


Audience Question:  Could you please re-explain the process of clearing?

Jackalyn Rainosek: If you see the handout sheet, it will say: Physically I feel… Emotionally I feel… Mentally I feel… and spiritually I feel… And I have given you a feeling list and feeling circle so that you can start learning some of the language of feelings again. Most of us have been trained out of feeling about the third grade, and then were told to be very mental in our process. So, we have to go back in and do that. So, what it is is a very simple process. I sit down each morning and I could say this, I’ll give you an example right at this moment in time. Physically, I feel energized and excited about what I’ve just talked to you all about. Emotionally, I feel grateful for so many people being present. The only thing I missed is being able to see you, I like to see people as well. Mentally, I feel gratified that so many of you thought this was a subject that you wanted some assistance on, and it’s a subject I’ve spent a lot of time on to make changes in myself. And then spiritually, I feel guided, directed, and I feel comforted by my higher power and know that somehow I’m continually being supported by something that I see this much greater than myself. So, that’s how I do it. And you’ll notice that I say the feeling statement first, and then I say the thought. Another thing I could have done very easily, as I could have just said physically, I feel energized emotionally. I feel grateful for the time with y’all. Mentally, I feel challenged because I’m going to be going and doing something with a new coaching program that I’m involved in. And spiritually, I feel vibrant. So that’s what I would answer to Vincent and that’s the best way to do it. What we’re trying to do is get you in touch with your feelings which then connect to your thoughts. That would be my answer to that question. And I hope I’ve given you sufficient information.


Audience Question: So, how should employees deal with or cope in their organizations that allow the cliques that exclude others? Because you talked about that earlier in your presentation. How do we cope? How do we deal?

Jackalyn Rainosek:  Well, it depends on whether you’re part of the clique or you’re not a part of the clique. Leanne, I’m not sure whether you’re part or you’re not. It sounds like that, and I’m not saying it’s either of those, I’ll just stick with the idea. The individuals that are not a part of the clique. I think one of the things that I teach them to do is identify someone that they seem to have a good conversation with each day, no matter what it is. And then they sit down, and they just talk about how they could have some more interactions, and maybe go to lunch together, or something like that. And I say to them, “You’re going to have to be selective.” And she said, “Well, I see another one that’s excluded. So maybe able to choose that one?” I said, “Well, that’s what you can do.” And you all can make your own group, and then maybe together, you can figure out a way that you can then approach someone else. That seems to have more connection with some of the groups in the organization. The person who’s part of some of these groups, I think need to reach out to those that are not in the group. We have no idea what the stress levels are in people’s lives. So, I’m always watching in organizations for people that have the power to then be able to include other people in the process.doing a program in Missouri on diversity. And what I did was I got two women connected, and then there was a third and fourth woman that combined and determine how they can allow this newcomer to have a much easier way to enter the organization. And I think that’s one of the things that I would say is… Difference is really valuable because it has given me a lot of enrichment in my life because I don’t have the same friends, that think like me, all the time. Now I will admit, there are some or many of my friends that do have similar attitudes, but I looked for things like that and so that’s what I would recommend, Leanne. And if I think it’s very important to look at each person and see what can I learn about them, so I can see how they contribute to the organization. If I do that, then I will best be less likely to look at things that I may see as different about them. That’s my answer.


Audience Question: You talked about people needing to have a voice in their organizations. But what do we do when we feel like we bring things up, we get our heads taken off? How do we bring things up with our bosses when we’re always afraid of how the director will act? 

Jackalyn Rainosek: Okay, wow, this one is a really good one. They’re all good, I’m very grateful. The questions have been outstanding. What I would say to you is, first, I have to determine what is the approach that a director may find valuable, and what is the way that I can approach the individual? Now, I’ll admit, if you have a director that is extremely difficult to talk to and really doesn’t want your opinion, then that’s another problem. I know in some of the military systems that I see, in police and sheriffs and whatever, sometimes you have to go around that person. Or you have to go above. And then find out what you can do. And I know that people are apprehensive about doing that because of the paramilitary idea. I would say that the first thing I would do is, I would write out exactly what I’m going to say, What are the concerns I have? What are the solutions that I can formulate for my concerns? And then, how can I present these ideas to this person? I think that one of the things I see the employees make a mistake on is they want to rush in and go in and talk to the person, and they’re not well prepared. If you have an outline of what you want to talk about, and you literally can put it in front of the individual, or either say, “I have an outline of some of the things I’d like to talk about. And I would ask that, if you could, please let me go through them, and then I would appreciate any suggestions you have.” I never say advice, because I don’t think advice comes from a positive place, I think, it comes from a superior place. So, I always ask for suggestions, but you can say, “Here’s something that I think is a problem. Here’s what I thought, could be the solution.” See, most executives, get the problem dumped on them, and the person sitting in front of them has never thought about some of the solutions going to happen. If you can conclude solutions, you may have a better chance.   I think another thing, too. There are some programs, like The Leadership Challenge, which teaches all people in the organization, how to be leaders, and how to have a voice. And that’s what made the difference in the Houston Municipal Courts. We provided it through to everyone in the organization, and they got the message, and as well as the deputy director kept, giving the message. You have a voice. Let me know how you feel, and she did town hall meetings. So that would be my answer.


Audience Question: Are there books that you would recommend about change or change management? 

Jackalyn Rainosek: I know I could provide a list of books that I think are very effective on change. I will tell you this if you get on my e-mail list, and you say, I want to know the articles you’ve written on change. I will send them to you because I think they’re better than some of the published books. I’m just going to be honest with you and say that, because they’re very practical, straightforward, and they tell human stories. So, I’d be happy if you send me that and say, “Could you please send me all the articles you have on change?” The other thing I would mention that you could do is McKinsey does an outstanding job on sending out materials all the time on various subjects. Now, some of them do not fit for y’all, because they’re more corporate, and they have some things on change that I do find very valuable, and I provide them in any institution I go into. So, you can go to McKinsey. And you can then go onto their topic lists and ask for things. They give you a lot of opportunities to get other factual material about things that are happening in the world, too. They have an excellent thing on inflation. They have an economist that talks about inflation, and so it’s helped a lot of the people I know, to say, Oh, wait a minute, now, understand what’s going on. So that’s what I would offer at this time.

Host: And I concur with that. I have read McKinsey for years and I couldn’t agree with you more. They are a fantastic resource. Again, as you said, they’re very corporate-oriented, but if you put the lens on of where we’re coming from, government, criminal justice. I find very often that the concepts they’re talking about can be applied to our fields as well. So, I think that’s a great resource.

Jackalyn Rainosek: Yeah, another thing is, if the person wants to e-mail me, then I will look up 1 or 2 of the major books that I have on change. I’m looking at the books because I’m sitting where my library is, so I will be happy to give them 1 or 2 readings that would be helpful. I will tell you this that one of the things that will change the most is if you read The Leadership Challenge book about leadership Jim Kouzes and Barry Posner have some of the best ideas about change that you’ll ever see. So, that’s another one. I’m a certified master with a group and I can tell you their materials are outstanding. Barry Posner and Jim Kouzes and the topic is the Leadership Challenge. That’s what their whole program is. Thank you. That’s what I can offer



Audience Question: What can we in the lower or the front ranks do when there is a large change in the organization that is very positive and important, but that it appears it is the top leaders themselves who seem to be slowing down the change? 

Jackalyn Rainosek: Oh, my gosh. Well, you have some good questions. Mary, I’ll tell you a story. And this will make it clear. After eight administrative associates were included with their executives in the Leadership Challenge, the eight of them came to me and said, we’ve been talking about being clean and green in Houston municipal courts in 20 locations for years, and it’s not happening. And so, the eight of us would like to get together. And we would like to put a proposal to, but we don’t know if the director will listen to this whenever. I started laughing, and I said, “Oh, yeah, I know this director she listened to you.” So, I took these women over. And I talked with Sharon, who was a director at the time, and I said, “Sharon, they have a great idea, and I really appreciate you to listen.” She said, “I’d like to hear it.” So, you then had them present. She said, “You have to tell me down to the dime how much this is going to cost. What are your plans? How are you going to carry it out? How long do you think it will take?” And they say, “Well, it takes about two years.” She said, “Fine, bring your proposal to the executive team.” So, I asked her two weeks later, “How was the proposal?” She said, “It was the most beautiful presentation I’ve ever seen.” She said, “You know, they’re great and powerful. They just slayed us with what they did.” They approved it. And those eight administrative associates are the reason the 20 locations in the Houston municipal courts now have clean and green containers and everything else. So, I think the key is having a way to have a plan or a way to present something that has some action and solutions in it.


Click Here to Watch a Recording of  Pain Comes from Resistance to Change: The Ways to Embrace Change. 


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